the way crisis of conscience lays it out, despite their reservations on doctrine, ray franz and ed dunlap would have been more than happy to live out their lives within the jw ranks without causing any disturbance.
ray was contemplating resigning from the gb and living out his life quietly somewhere outside bethel.
ed preferred to remain in bethel due to his advanced age.
Another possible answer, however, is that the GB began to sense their grip of power slipping away and decided to bring the hammer down.
The GB was new to power during this period and they didn't know how to wield it. Add to that the irrationality and belief that they were on a mission from God and you've got your explanation.
And not to derail this thread, but why do people feel the need to diss Crisis of Conscience and/or Ray Franz?
i was talking with a witness the other day (mistake number 1) and i brought up a quote from the 80's.
the friggin 1980's and he said "that was old light we don't believe that anymore...".
i mean at what point can they start throwing out these quotes?
aSphereisnotaCircle is correct.
All light is current until replaced by newer light. If it hasn't been replaced then it's still current light.
So the standard answer to a "that's old light" statement from a Dub is to ask for a quotation from a newer book or mag with the new light in it. If they can't provide one then you can call BS on them.
Which reminds me. Is there a thread anywhere in here that lists absurd beliefs that have never been discarded (in other words, still current light)?
this is the final of my series of podcasts in which the 3 circuit overseers decide my fate as a jehovah's witness.. my blog- deathorobedience.blogspot.com.
podcast 12 the final verdict- play the audio.
also available free on itunes (just search on itunes).. .
I haven't had a chance to listen yet but I hope to soon. As for recording these clowns without their knowledge or consent, good for you, Matt! They don't deserve the respect you'd be showing by asking permission or by playing according to their rules. They're representatives of a dangerous mind control cult that ruins families and ruins lives. Good luck with your new JW-free life, Matt.
looks like they're almost begging for elders and ms's.
take a fresh look.
the need for overseers and ministerial servants is greater today than ever before.we.
Can you imagine an elders' meeting if it was a mixed-sex group?
there are a great many reasons it becomes difficult to "prove" to active jw's that the watchtower society has had an amazing series of crackpot teachings, beliefs and assertions over the years.. first off, the availability of old publications is problematic.
the society has cleverly sucked them out of the libraries of local kingdom halls.
older collectors are often dead or apostate.. ebay can provide steep asking-prices.. but--a few years back, i discovered the availability of reprints in quality self-published form on lulu.com and amazon.. these reprints are beautifully done and easier to read than an old, moth-eaten, mildew-stained yellowy tome from the early era!.
Easy to 'age' one, too. Underline some key points in pencil, leave it outside overnight in the fog, dry it out, repeat...THEN send it to one of your JW friends.
I don't know many JWs who would throw away ANY WT literature, no matter how old. They're reluctant to throw away decades-old magazines even though they have bound volumes and CD Rom versions already. They may not read it but they won't throw them away.
looks like they're almost begging for elders and ms's.
take a fresh look.
the need for overseers and ministerial servants is greater today than ever before.we.
I personally know of 4 brothers who have "stepped down" in the last year, 2 elders and 2 MS. That's just in one fairly rural geographic area (not all the same cong). Spread that out across the country (USA) and we're looking at hundreds or more likely thousands stepping down lately.
record of committee meeting #1. after prayer, proverbs 28:13 was read: "he who is covering over his transgressions will not succeed, but he who is confessing and leaving them will be shown mercy.
" the need to confess to jehovah was emphasized.
as jehovah's representatives, the elders said we therefore needed to confess to them.
Given my performance at session #1, it's not looking too good. I just want to be free of the cult burdens. I'll even go so far as to accompany the wife to all the meetings, so long as no further expectations are imposed upon me save sitting there and ignoring everybody, which I wanted to do anyway.
I hate that you still seem to be looking at this as some kind of a defeat, Christopher.
Getting out of the borg is a win for you and if your wife is patient with you and is willing to do her duty as the JWs lay it out for her, you'll have time to show her that it's a win for her, too. You WILL be a better husband for it. You ARE already a good person. You DO love her.
You DON'T owe the elders or the congregation ANYthing. You don't even have to show up at the next JC meeting.
If you are going to be resigned to let whatever happens happen, then REALLY do that. Just let it happen. Don't let the flow of the world carry you in its current; STOP, stand still, and just observe it. Let it flow until the torrent is a mere wading trickle and then walk barefoot in the cooling freshness of a new life.
Here's a little something I read earlier today. Maybe it can help you a little.
"Empty the self completely;
Embrace perfect peace.
The world will rise and move;
Watch it return to rest.
All the flourishing things
Will return to their source.
This return is peaceful;
It is the flow of nature,
An eternal decay and renewal.
Accepting this brings enlightenment,
Ignoring this brings misery.
Who accepts nature's flow becomes all-cherishing;
Being all-cherishing he becomes impartial;
Being impartial he becomes magnanimous;
Being magnanimous he becomes natural;
Being natural he becomes one with the Way;
Being one with the Way he becomes immortal:
Though his body will decay, the Way will not."
remember all the stupid special needs talks?
i remember one that was about a kid picking up a $5 bill outside of the kingdom hall.
he looked around to see if anyone around him lost it, and when no one did, he decided to keep it.
What's most wacky about the original poster's situation is that one goofball elder can't decide what the local needs part is going to be; it has to be determined and agreed upon by the entire body.
What a loony thing to say from the platform! If you find money on the ground and you can't easily find out who lost it, IT IS YOURS. A better local needs part would have been on securing one's wallets and purses so as to avoid dropping money on the ground!
this thread is prompted by the thread about a jw woman who disprupted a funeral.
i don't know the details as i can't view youtube from work, but it did get me to thinking.... over the last couple of decades, at least, i've noticed that more and more 'fringe personalities', for a lack of a better term, have infiltrated the ranks of the everyday jws.
true, jws are themselves a fringe element to normal society, but even within their own communities, there used to be a sense of normalcy, or at least seemed to be.. has the cultic message of the wt society started attracting people with different thought processes over this time period?
I think stating that they are "all" looney is just hyperbole. I'm sticking to my 20% loons number. There are a lot of normal people trapped in the cult because trapping people is what cults are good at doing.
well for those of you who many not know i gave birth to a beautiful baby boy on the 31st jan, however our joy soon turned to concern when it was discovered our son had breathing problems.
this concern later turned to fear as we learned that he had a congenital diaphragmatic hernia (cdh) and that he would need an operation asap.. basically our baby had a hole in his diaphragm and most of his digestive system now resided in his left chest cavity compressing his heart and lungs into the remain space in the right cavity.
this is a very serious condition and much of the information we were given made very bleak reading.
Congratulations on the birth of your child and good luck with his continued recovery.
The borg certainly dehumanizes people within by encouraging them to view those on the outside as future bird food.
